Is lent purely a Catholic thing or do all Christians do it?

Yep - Catholic.

Where does it even say "Lent" in the Bible? Is it in the 'Original Latin?' :P

Whats the matter? Sacrificing meat once a year gonna hurt youz?

Peter really screwed the pooch when he started his church, didn't he?

it's a Catholic sacrament


It's not a sacrament

wrong

Why? Since it does not fall under any of your beliefs, it must be wrong.

Right it is not a sacrament, like I said before. It is more of a time of reflection. It represents the 40 days, not including Sundays,that Jesus spent in the wilderness preparing for His ministry by facing the temptations that could lead him to abandon his mission and calling

This is the reason not all those others you came up with, at least for Catholics. It is not any of the things you listed

I do not see it as a ritual...

YZF is just trying to say his spirituality trumps any organized religion. That he is the only one going to heaven....:rolleyes:

Whats wrong with a ritual? Observance of God....in ritual form can be just as pleasing to Him as a non ritual.

Luke 22:19

19And he took bread, gave thanks and broke it, and gave it to them, saying, "This is my body given for you; do this in remembrance of me."


Hey it looks like Jesus himself commanded a ritual....

Give me a break schizo mark...you make no point here.

The vision of Isaiah the son of Amoz, which he saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem in the days of Uzziah, Jotham, Ahaz, and Hezekiah, kings of Judah:

Hear, O heavens, and give ear, O earth: for the LORD hath spoken, I have nourished and brought up children, and they have rebelled against me.

The ox knows his owner, and the ass his master's crib: but Israel doth not know, my people doth not consider. Ah sinful nation, a people laden with iniquity, a seed of evildoers, children that are corrupters: they have forsaken the LORD, they have provoked the Holy One of Israel unto anger, they are gone away backward. Why should ye be stricken any more? ye will revolt more and more: the whole head is sick, and the whole heart faint.

From the sole of the foot even unto the head there is no soundness in it; but wounds, and bruises, and putrefying sores: they have not been closed, neither bound up, neither mollified with ointment. Your country is desolate, your cities are burned with fire: your land, strangers devour it in your presence, and it is desolate, as overthrown by strangers. And the daughter of Zion is left as a cottage in a vineyard, as a lodge in a garden of cucumbers, as a besieged city. Except the LORD of hosts had left unto us a very small remnant, we should have been as Sodom, and we should have been like unto Gomorrah.

Hear the word of the LORD, ye rulers of Sodom; give ear unto the law of our God, ye people of Gomorrah. To what purpose is the multitude of your sacrifices unto me? saith the LORD: I am full of the burnt offerings of rams, and the fat of fed beasts; and I delight not in the blood of bullocks, or of lambs, or of he goats. When ye come to appear before me, who has required this at your hand, to tread my courts? Bring no more vain oblations; incense is an abomination unto me; the new moons and sabbaths, the calling of assemblies, I cannot away with; it is iniquity, even the solemn meeting.

Your new moons and your appointed feasts my soul hates: they are a trouble unto me; I am weary to bear them. And when ye spread forth your hands, I will hide mine eyes from you: yea, when ye make many prayers, I will not hear: your hands are full of blood.


Wash you, make you clean; put away the evil of your doings from before mine eyes; cease to do evil; Learn to do well; seek judgment, relieve the oppressed, judge the fatherless, plead for the widow.

Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.


. . . Isaiah, part of the first chapter.

while he is talking about the gospel, you are countering with the old testament.....not exactly a good comparison, tofu

while he is talking about the gospel, you are countering with the old testament.....not exactly a good comparison, tofu

Why? It's the same unchanging God.

I countered before whitepep posted, I wasn't referring to his post.

Though, his post is really not a valid argument.

A 'ritual' declared by God is quite a bit different then one made up by men.

god is all about authority, a master who leads his flock.

the catholics have a leader of their church, yzf's swarm doesn't.

harping about the 'living' christ fails to obscure the FACT that he has gone AWAY, he is NOT at the head of his church so he HAS no church just random clumps of Believers so desperate for the Leadership promised that they follow the 'leadership' of anybody with undiagnosed schizophrenia.

at least the catholics HAVE a church with a Leader who is at least POTENTIALLY chosen by jesus to act in his stead, him being gone and all.

if jesus could start rites he could delegate that ability to the Leader of his Church.

right

and there's certainly nothing wrong with reflecting on that, but to define it as some ritual is not good

Why is it not a good thing? You may say that it is not Biblically relevant, and you're probably right about that, but to speak of it as those it is something dangerous makes no sense to me.

Perhaps you don't know what exactly Lent entails?

a false leader

Christ is the head of the church...the N.T. only prescribes elders, deacons (overseers), and pastor-teachers



really?

Revelation 2

To the angel of the church in Ephesus write:

These are the words of him who holds the seven stars in his right hand and walks among the seven golden lampstands [symbolic of the churches]: I know your deeds, your hard work and your perseverance. I know that you cannot tolerate wicked men, that you have tested those who claim to be apostles but are not, and have found them false. You have persevered and have endured hardships for my name, and have not grown weary. Yet I hold this against you: You have forsaken your first love. Remember the height from which you have fallen! Repent and do the things you did at first. If you do not repent, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place. But you have this in your favor: You hate the practices of the Nicolaitans, which I also hate. He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To him who overcomes, I will give the right to eat from the tree of life, which is in the paradise of God.


howcome you assume the lampstands are symbolic ?

maybe the pope has them in his throne room {he's just keeping it warm for jesus, performing his moseslike leadership thing in the absence of the Lord Himself. }

the point is they are SINGLE lampholders, point sources of light, holders of gods sacred flame, what he is going to light hell with.

remember, hell was formed out of water, it hasn't been lit yet.

it takes a Man to do that, god isn't one.

so he is making one, through His church.

yzf, god hands you a lit lamp and tells you to toss it into the lake of water and light it, so that all those people in it will burn for eternity.

because at the judgment throne god had to force them to bow to him.

of course you will, as will the six other stern looking men jostling for position.

obligatory hitler comparison.*

:bowdown: :screwyou:

:edit; *one of those six men with a funny moustache, another with a funny hat.

god is all about authority, a master who leads his flock.

the catholics have a leader of their church, yzf's swarm doesn't.

Oh, don't kid yourself. While the Catholics have specialized in swathing the Pope in pomp, ritual, and gold the born-agains have their own leaders. While they often call themselves Evangelicals they are, in fact, Dominionists - especially when calling for Creation to be taught in schools, the institutionalized execution of homosexuals, etc... yet they still manage to exact their own form of tithe. Remember the Bakers, with a Rolls Royce mounted on an awning? Or Oral Roberts swearing God will "Call him home" unless his followers dug deep and gave him millions of dollars...

Oh, don't kid yourself. While the Catholics have specialized in swathing the Pope in pomp, ritual, and gold the born-agains have their own leaders. While they often call themselves Evangelicals they are, in fact, Dominionists - especially when calling for Creation to be taught in schools, the institutionalized execution of homosexuals, etc... yet they still manage to exact their own form of tithe. Remember the Bakers, with a Rolls Royce mounted on an awning? Or Oral Roberts swearing God will "Call him home" unless his followers dug deep and gave him millions of dollars...

News to me O_o

You should up and sucker-punch a couple of those TV pastors, they really give Christians a bad name.

i would pay to see that. on tv.
you could roll on in their congregation on your yzf-r1, jump off chuck norris style and punch them in the face!

no wonder the antichrist will take his seat of power in, you guessed it, Rome!

not my guess. I would guess an anti Christian function, Muslims. Def not catholics.

I guess this got a little off track.

For the record Lent is not a Ritual

because it's defined! do you have even the SLIGHTEST idea what you're talking about?

Revelation 1

Write, therefore, what you have seen, what is now and what will take place later. The mystery of the seven stars that you saw in my right hand and of the seven golden lampstands is this: The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches, and the seven lampstands are the seven churches.

jesus IS god while still being a separate entity, so I don't see the big deal with a lampstand being a literal lampstand and still being a Church, it's defining totem sort of thing.

if you assume everybody around you is idiots, it is amazing how often you can prove yourself right.

when you consider gods passion for his holy fire in his temple, his choosing lampstands to symbolize his Churches {what ? more than ONE authorized church ? !!!!! } flows TOTALLY well.

"The mystery of the seven golden lampstands is this: the seven lampstands are the seven churches."

HAS the Lake Of Fire been lit yet ?
I do not remember reading anything about god having lit it, it is always spoken of as already having been lit that I have noticed.

what sweeter savour could there be than the smoke of eternally burning sin-filled humanity ?

{at least the unforgiven portion, since ALL humanity is sin-filled.}

a part of the sweetness of the savour has got to be having somebody else doing it FOR you.

lighting the Lake Of Fire would be the ultimate act of humanity in service to god.

:bowdown: :screwyou:


note: the lamp tossing ceremony could be what the angel{?} was muttering about that needed to be kept secret from even saved humanity.
{remember ? that "don't write that bit down" business}

Why? It's the same unchanging God.

I countered before whitepep posted, I wasn't referring to his post.

Though, his post is really not a valid argument.

A 'ritual' declared by God is quite a bit different then one made up by men.

the same god but not the same circumstance.

You brought up the people of Sodom, who were sacrificing too many animals according to God. He brought up Jesus offering his body as a sacrifice to us, not even close to the same thing. And besides, the same God doesnt make everything the same. In the OT, David prayed for God to kill his enemies, but in the NT, Jesus commanded NOT to do that. Different times, different circumstances, you overlook those and thats pretty simplistic of you.

who cares?

it's usually a good assumption, when it comes to your wacky statements about the Bible

so the whole point of creation is a competition for the seven openings for the folks who get to light Hell.

to be one of the Casters.

judgement begins when god takes the final Caster bodily to heaven.

as a favor, god lets satan hand the Lamps to the chosen ones, the leaders of the seven Churches.

{the lamps are supplied by a small jewish cult who have maintained the Sacred Flame that burned in front of moses' tent, with help from the Ark of The Covenant, the writing on the Stone Tablets changing with new instructions from god [ note; the Tablets got quite warm around 0 A.D.].}

so, given that the above in no way actually CONTRADICTS anything in the bible, its sole objectional quality being that it is not actually written {mostly, 99%} word for word in the bible, what SPIRITUAL values do you find flaw with ?

if satan tells you to light hell, with god nodding from His Throne behind and above him, is it moral to refuse ?

{"what ? you think God doesn't KNOW I am telling you this ? " - serpent to Eve.}

:bowdown: :firedevil:.

{I quite enjoy how yzf's eyes are looking at the Trinity above and behind gods faithful servant :bigthumb: }

it is a perfectly valid psychotic scenerio based ENTIRELY on gods word that proposes a moral question that forces you to look at the absolute morality of the bible.

is it moral for you to light the fires of hell so that countless billions of people may be burned alive therein for eternity ?

hell was originally created for fallen angels

right, the need to punish billions of people for eternity came as a complete surprise to him.

note, do NOT offer to light the lamps with your zippo, god is touchy about his fire, and you might lose your place among the Casters.

um, why would angels need pain receptor nerves, living in heaven seems unlikely to be noticibly painful.

why would angels need pain receptor nerves.

so masochistic angels can have fun too - duh. ;)

Good answer.

terrifying...horrifying

Now thanks be to God who always leads us in triumph in Christ, and through us diffuses the fragrance of His knowledge in every place.

so why should PERFECT justice be "terrifying...horrifying" ?

it's not, what is terrifying...horrifying, is DEFEAT by your self declared ENEMY who GLORIES in his triumph over his helpless foe.

a foe who REMAINS his enemy EVEN IN DEFEAT.

note that gods self declared enemies won't be thinking about ANYTHING except their skin burning off, it will be god who holds ALL of the hate close to his heart as he wallows in the screams of all the billions of souls he decided to hate.

keeping his love only for those who proved willing to light the fires of torment for those who god CHOSE TO HATE, to declare his enemy.

what does this have to do with Lent?

post 5 page 1

add lent to eucharist, praying to mary, confession to "priests", the heresey of the office of "pope", and a host of other false, extra-Biblical "doctrines" invented by the Roman system

2 Corinthians 11

Oh, that you would bear with me in a little folly—and indeed you do bear with me. For I am jealous for you with godly jealousy. For I have betrothed you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ. But I fear, lest somehow, as the serpent deceived Eve by his craftiness, so your minds may be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. For if he who comes preaches another Jesus whom we have not preached, or if you receive a different spirit which you have not received, or a different gospel which you have not accepted—you may well put up with it

so what happens to those who follow one who preaches a gosple that 'we' have not preached ?

gods perfect justice


so why should PERFECT justice be "terrifying...horrifying" ?

it's not, what is terrifying...horrifying, is DEFEAT by your self declared ENEMY who GLORIES in his triumph over his helpless foe.

a foe who REMAINS his enemy EVEN IN DEFEAT.

note that gods self declared enemies won't be thinking about ANYTHING except their skin burning off, it will be god who holds ALL of the hate close to his heart as he wallows in the screams of all the billions of souls he decided to hate.

keeping his love only for those who proved willing to light the fires of torment for those who god CHOSE TO HATE, to declare his enemy.

on topic.

god created hell and plans to torture billions of people there for eternity.

what part of that is claptrap ?

god created hell and plans to torture billions of people there for eternity.

what part of that is NOT evil ?


it's extremely dangerous

because He will do something EVIL to me to prove to YOU that you are lucky to be Chosen to be spared the evil he will bring down on everybody else.

I POINT OUT god doing evil, it's everywhere in the bible, everything god does is evil in its own right or has an immediate result of evil.

I still have heard of NOTHING good god has ever done, with the SOLE exception of letting satan run wild on earth with superpowers to torment and torture humanity, to be nice to satan.

the good in that although present, is slight and in my opinion waaay overbalanced by the evil done by satan in gods name.

how about creation? is the creation evil?

yup, creating hell to torture billions forever so that thousands will be terrified enough to spend eternity in thanks for not sending them to hell too, that's evil.

any and all goodness that happens in this reality is despite the will of god and will be punished by god in the end.

what does this have to do with Lent?

lol

Edit: yah! 600

is creation evil?

is creation CURSED ?

is the curse effective against animals who are incapable of sin ?

is the curse inherited as the sin is inherited, not earned through any act but a direct individual gift of hate. ?



you certainly enjoy it, every day of your life

good food,

which part of every mouthful of nourishment requiring some other creature to die and be dismembered is good ?


clean water,


bright sunshine,


an ocean shore, a quiet forest

a corrupt mind hates God for such things

is creation CURSED ?

is the curse effective against animals who are incapable of sin ?

is the curse inherited as the sin is inherited, not earned through any act but a direct individual gift of hate. ?


Cursed? define your terms.

eden was not cursed, the kids bugged god so he cast them out into a cursed world as punishment.

death, disease

eden was not cursed, the kids bugged god so he cast them out into a cursed world as punishment.

death, disease

So then in your mind, the presence of a forbidden fruit, destined to lead Eden's inhabitants to succumb to temptation, does not qualify as a curse. Interesting...