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Join in on this Discussion and see the pictures. Click here-> : One preacher's message: Have hotter sex


BATMAN
09-14-2006, 09:19 AM
About 100 evangelical Christian couples stand in the convention hall of a Four Points Sheraton, bow their heads and thank God for their lives and the new day. Then they sing the old-timey hymn “There’s Not a Friend Like the Lowly Jesus.”

I have come here expecting exactly this scene. The occasion is a seminar called “Love, Sex and Marriage,” being given by Joe Beam, a Southern preacher out of the old school, a self-described “book-chapter-and-verse guy,” who runs an outfit based in Franklin, Tenn., called Family Dynamics. So I’m anticipating condemnation of American culture — especially America’s sexual culture — that has made conservative Christians feel besieged.

But then Beam, a portly, silver-haired basso profundo dressed in khaki slacks, a sweater vest and brown tasseled loafers that make him look like a retired country-club golf pro, walks to the front of the room and proceeds to tell the men in the audience how to make their semen taste better.

Sweet stuff works, he says, which provides a built-in excuse because "then you can say, 'I'm eating this cake for you, baby!'"

Welcome to the world of hot Christian love.

The San Diego Church of Christ is Beam’s sponsoring group today, but as far as he is concerned it could be any conservative Christian denomination. The message would be the same: Married Christians ought to be having more — and hotter — sex.

You could be forgiven for thinking “conservative Christian” and “hot sex” are oxymoronic. The missionary position has a real history, after all. But Beam is part of a burgeoning trend among evangelicals to bring sex out of the shadows, educate believers and relieve their guilt.

"For years, Christian publishing would not publish on sex," says Michael Sytsma, a Christian sex therapist with the Sexual Wholeness Ministry based in Duluth, Ga. "If they did, it was so heavily edited nothing of value was left. Now, more and more pastors are preaching about it on Sunday, though you still do not see classes in seminaries. We are seeking to do that."

Sytsma thinks preachers like Beam have seen — and even felt themselves — the impact of the sexual revolution, and realize the church has been left behind as a source of sexual information.

“Sex is a sacred subject," he says. “The church generally prefers not to talk about it. But that has a dual impact. It keeps it shrouded in ignorance and the implication is that since you are not talking about it, it’s bad.”

God's 'most wonderful gift'
Beam sees this attitude every day. Women tell him: “I feel like I am sinning when I make love to my husband.”

“They want help,” he tells the assembled crowd under the tent. At least a score of heads nod in recognition. “It’s hard,” he continues, “to make the transition from ‘sex is bad’ when you are young and single to ‘sex is good’ when you are married.” In fact, “sex is the most wonderful gift God ever gave Christians.”

Beam, who is studying for a sexology Ph.D. from the University of Sydney in Australia, is all about shining the light. He and a few others like him have concluded that conservative Christians can cope with America’s hypersexualized culture by being given permission to pluck much of its fruit.

The information he dispenses is a mix of scriptural interpretation and mainstream sexology. He does not speak in euphemisms or metaphors and his plain spokeness makes a few listeners squirm, at first. But Beam is also part entertainer with a patter that is almost vaudevillian in its timing: “Why can women be multiorgasmic and men not? Well, I’ve decided God just likes you better! ... What’s the difference between a woman with PMS and a Doberman? Lipstick.”

The humor and the brazen talk, coming from a man who is not only one of them, but a leader who rubs elbows with James Dobson and Jerry Falwell, gives them permission to relax and hear his message.

It’s a simple one: Sex is good. Good sex makes people happy. It deepens relationships. So it helps marriages last and that pleases God and makes society better.

There are rules many in the secular world reject. You have to be married. You have to be heterosexual. Other prohibitions include no sex with animals, no incest, no lust for people other than your spouses, no adultery (and that includes consensual threesomes and group sex) and no porn, rape or prostitution. You can’t harm the body. And you can’t have sex during a woman’s menstrual period.

If that last one seems like an outlier — there is no particular health reason to avoid sex during menstruation among monogamous, disease-free couples — you don’t understand Beam’s world view.

Scripture is his authority. Like other evangelicals, he believes the New Testament is the literal and infallible word of God. So when the book of Acts says, “You are to abstain from food sacrificed to idols, from blood, from the meat of strangled animals and from sexual immorality,” that’s all he needs to know.

No inhibitions
This literalist view cuts both ways. Beam has been attacked by some conservative Christians for his liberal take on certain subjects. Much of what he preaches contradicts the teaching of other sects, such as Roman Catholicism. But he argues that if the Bible does not forbid it, you can do it. So bring on masturbation. Try any position in the Kama Sutra (but refer to drawings, please, not pictures of real people). Wife away on business? Have phone sex. Birth control is good. Even anal sex is OK if (and Beam believes this is a big if) it does no harm to the body.

If you are a married Christian, not only can you do all this, but you should be doing it.

“Christians should be having great sex lives! We should be having better sex than anybody else! So drop your inhibitions at the door of your own house.”

The crowd is obviously ready to do just that.

“Our church has tried to be more open about sex, and to be more real about it,” Mary Wadstrom, a member of the San Diego church and, along with her husband, Jeff, one of the organizers of today’s sessions, tells me half-way through Beam’s lecture. “There are lots of hang-ups ingrained on you every day.”

That’s very clear after Beam takes a break, giving time for attendees to fill out question cards. They’re supposed to be free to ask anything that’s been on their minds. When Beam returns he flips through the cards and says, “I am looking at your questions and let me say, you are a sick group of people!”

Everybody cracks up yet again. He begins reading:

Can you give us some techniques for oral sex?

He does, and, using his hand and arm as props, describes it in detail (“…creating suction and warmth with your mouth, your tongue here…”) complete with sound effects.

Is mutual masturbation OK?

"Yes."

Which sex toys are good, and can we use them at all?

“I usually get the question this way,” Beam answers. “‘What does the Bible say about vibrators?” More laughter. “Can we use a vibrator? Sure you can if you want to.”

What can you do if your wife is having trouble reaching orgasm?

“Try having sex doggy-style and simultaneously masturbating.”

He offers another suggestion: “You’ve heard of the proverbial 69?” Some in the audience return blank stares. He stares back, open-mouthed, and gently mocks them. “Huh? Is that in Acts?”

Unburdened — and eager to get home
The explicitness causes some jaws to drop, but not because people are offended.

“What is new for me is not that kind of talk,” Wadstrom says. The church has had some sexual conversations before, but always in classes segregated by gender.

“What was new is having men and women together in the same room," she says. "That was very helpful because everybody knows what’s being said to the others.”

Beam's presentation has a liberating effect on these couples. About four hours later, when it’s all over, many appeared unburdened. Either they were experimenting anyway, and feeling miserable about it, or they were restricting themselves to acts they thought were godly, and feeling miserable about that.

“I was raised to think sex was bad,” 23-year-old Kym Blackburn recalls of her religious upbringing. She forced her husband, Matt, a U.S. Navy enlisted man, to attend, but now he is glad he did. He is awaiting a second deployment to Iraq, and thinks their marriage will grow stronger in the weeks before he leaves.

Jose and Marta Ochoa echo that sentiment. “My whole life I thought certain things were wrong, or not Christian,” Marta, 47, tells me as her husband, Jose, 52, nods vigorously in the background.

He’d spent years asking her for more variation but now, finally, “she understands we can share all this freely and it’s not a sin like she thought. It is gonna happen more!”

That, Marta tells me, makes her very happy.

Then they excuse themselves. They’re in a rush to get home.

BATMAN
09-14-2006, 01:01 PM
No surprise that if it doesn't agree with ur "brand" of bible thumping, it must be wrong.

What's wrong with sex between a hubby and wifey?

U have too many restrictions - more so that what GOD probably intended, if that.

Grand Wizard Hornsby
09-14-2006, 03:52 PM
I am extremexc0re christian nazi (i'm a freaking grand wizard for cripe sake), and i think talking about sex is wrong. we need to keep the subject under wraps at all costs. if you ask me what sex is i'll tell you it doesnt exist, because this is how we deal with reality. thank god for aids, and mass destruction and genocide (no just kidding)

BATMAN
09-14-2006, 04:56 PM
so if ur not in it for reproducing, then don't fuck?

If so, fuck that.

skydivr7673
09-14-2006, 08:51 PM
nope, never said that....read Song of Solomon sometime

You just got done downplaying this whole concept, and then you contradict yourself immediately afterwards and do a 180....nice....

Anyhoo, you should just stick to preaching about being single--it is really difficult to fathom a single, never-married guy, trying to tell people how they should view sex when married. You have never been there, never experienced it, so how can you teach anyone about it?

The seminar, in case you did not understand, is actually not a bad idea at all. you see, many married couples go through a hard time with the concept of Sex and God. They are left trying to figure out "the rules"....what is acceptable? What isnt? For example, Traditional religious speakers do not often talk about whether or not oral sex is acceptable, etc etc. There are many areas where it is easy to see a lot of people having questions. But you have never been in this situation, so how would you know?

Married couples who desire to live together in Christ need good resources for all aspects of that life, dont you think? Go read I Corinthians 7 sometime....it contains such high-quality instruction as:

1Now for the matters you wrote about: It is good for a man not to marry.[a] 2But since there is so much immorality, each man should have his own wife, and each woman her own husband. 3The husband should fulfill his marital duty to his wife, and likewise the wife to her husband. 4The wife's body does not belong to her alone but also to her husband. In the same way, the husband's body does not belong to him alone but also to his wife. 5Do not deprive each other except by mutual consent and for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer. Then come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control. 6I say this as a concession, not as a command.

But like I said, you have not experienced Christianity under such circumstances.....

skydivr7673
09-14-2006, 09:23 PM
the principles of scripture regarding marriage are plain as day, whether or not I've been married is of zero relevance to the topic

stay on the topic jonnie, not me, or I'll get you tossed right outta here

ok, look, my post was 100% relevant to the topic. Stop whining. Talking about the specific POV you just posted IS RELEVANT. You whining about "having me thrown outta here" however is NOT RELEVANT. Would you care to stick to the topic??


there are no rules within marriage....if you wanna 69 with your wife, step up, but talking about it in public, or in the context of a sermon, is seriously warped, that's the point....this "pastor" is not interested in teaching the Bible, he's interested in getting more people to join his "church" by talking about sex

ahh, you are are wrong....there ARE rules within the marriage. I listed a couple of them already for you. In any case, you fail to understand that so many people WANT TO UNDERSTAND MORE ABOUT THE BIBLE and how it impacts their daily life. This is a LEARNING issue, Mark, plain and simple. Not everyone knows as much about this or that in scripture as everyone else. Because of that, TEACHING is a good thing, as long as it follows the true message. And, when your audience is entirely made up of married couples, this is a very relevant issue to discuss. Suppose there was a couple there that thought differently about sex?? Wouldnt learning what the Bible instructs be beneficial to that couple???

Again, stop whining. You are talking about reading the scripture, and thats all, because once again, you are not in that boat. Anyone can recite scripture, Marky--putting it into practice is somewhat different, dontcha think?? Anyone can flip to the appropriate page and read away....not everyone will get all the specific answers from that. The Bible does not specifically clarify everything about every sexual act, position, etc etc etc, so for you to try to put this in a tidy little box only shows that you have not had to deal with this issue.

skydivr7673
09-14-2006, 09:24 PM
Additionally, Proverbs 5 has something to say on the issue:

18 May your fountain be blessed,
and may you rejoice in the wife of your youth.

19 A loving doe, a graceful deer—
may her breasts satisfy you always,
may you ever be captivated by her love.

skydivr7673
09-14-2006, 10:16 PM
those are guidelines for success in marriage...there are no "rules" regarding sex itself....stop switching the context like you always do

no rules?? Why sure there are....for example, if a married couple wishes to consent to having a third person join them in the bedroom, THAT IS AGAINST THE RULES THAT YOU CLAIM DO NOT EXIST. Thanks for playing:peace:

again, there are no rules regarding the sex act within marriage, assuming homosexuality or something obviously immoral is not part of the equation

Apparently, you forgot to think about the fact that people dont always know as much as others....and for this purpose, LEARNING exists. Like I said, it is entirely possible that a couple would have such questions...especially if one person or both have not had "experience"....so, couples who wish to learn what is and is not acceptable in marriage, according to God, would not be in the wrong to listen to such instruction. End of story.

not sure what your point was in quoting that...I don't think you know

I sure do--it goes towards the concept that sex in marriage is not just there for reproduction. This addresses your earlier comment.

czarofzar
09-15-2006, 06:06 AM
You just got done downplaying this whole concept, and then you contradict yourself immediately afterwards and do a 180....nice....

Anyhoo, you should just stick to preaching about being single--it is really difficult to fathom a single, never-married guy, trying to tell people how they should view sex when married. You have never been there, never experienced it, so how can you teach anyone about it?

The seminar, in case you did not understand, is actually not a bad idea at all. you see, many married couples go through a hard time with the concept of Sex and God. They are left trying to figure out "the rules"....what is acceptable? What isnt? For example, Traditional religious speakers do not often talk about whether or not oral sex is acceptable, etc etc. There are many areas where it is easy to see a lot of people having questions. But you have never been in this situation, so how would you know?

Married couples who desire to live together in Christ need good resources for all aspects of that life, dont you think? Go read I Corinthians 7 sometime....it contains such high-quality instruction as:



But like I said, you have not experienced Christianity under such circumstances.....


+1
studies find most stringent xtain families dont talk about sex since it is taboo resulting in miseriable marriges. Thier reality is thier nose in old parchments of yesteryear and try to apply that to today. It's sad.

skydivr7673
09-15-2006, 06:36 AM
lol

same old jonnie techniques: proven wrong on one point of scripture, immediately swtich to some tangential topic, claim victory, and announce "thanks for playing!"

my gosh you are predictable :rolleyes:

as I previosuly said, there are no rules placed on sex within the confines of marriage, a third person is not a marriage as defined in Genesis, and clearly immoral

look, I was just adding to the convo here, with very relevant points and posts. Either you stop whining about me or this WILL get addressed, understood? Nowhere did I attack you in any way--I merely stated a polite, non-insulting reply to your POV which is very much allowed. This is the second time within a day that you cannot stop with this crap--either keep it on topic without the personal garbage or it will be handled.

In either case, you should pay better attention--the scripture was in no way meant to distract from my main point that many people need to get answers to questions because they dont all know them already. When you were just starting life as a Christian, did you have all the answers?? Man, you dont have them all now, and how long has it been?? If YOU dont like the point, thats fine, but you are not in a position to accurately speak for everyone in Christianity on the matter, so stop trying.

The additional scripture was to point out something entirely different. And it did.

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