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95whitepep 01-07-2009, 04:16 PM In Charles Darwin's On the Origin of Species (1859) and in his later works, he referred to several "vestiges" in human anatomy that were left over from the course of evolution. These vestigial organs, Darwin argued, are evidence of evolution and represent a function that was once necessary for survival, but over time that function became either diminished or nonexistent.
The presence of an organ in one organism that resembles one found in another has led biologists to conclude that these two might have shared a common ancestor. Vestigial organs have demonstrated remarkably how species are related to one another, and has given solid ground for the idea of common descent to stand on. From common descent, it is predicted that organisms should retain these vestigial organs as structural remnants of lost functions. It is only because of macro-evolutionary theory, or evolution that takes place over very long periods of time, that these vestiges appear.
The term "vestigial organ" is often poorly defined, most commonly because someone has chosen a poor source to define the term. The Oxford English Dictionary (OED) defines vestigial organs as organs or structures remaining or surviving in a degenerate, atrophied, or imperfect condition or form. This is the accepted biological definition used in the theory of evolution.
In the never-ending search for scientific truth, hypotheses are proposed, evidence is found, and theories are formulated to describe and explain what is being observed in the world around us. The following are ten observations of vestigial organs whose presence have helped to flesh out the structure of the family tree that includes every living creature on our planet.
-- Brandon Miller
BackyardSog 01-07-2009, 04:28 PM lol @ "proven" to have a designed purpose.
"Well guys we really proved this one but we can't afford the electric bill on our creationist trailer park lab. Better luck next time".
95whitepep 01-07-2009, 05:18 PM So then what does the appendix do? Is that the God organ?
DivineRightOfManiacs 01-07-2009, 05:41 PM Well by Oxford's definition, Mark's head is a vestigial organ.
DivineRightOfManiacs 01-07-2009, 05:50 PM ...In that case, your dick must be a vestigial organ, too.
Tofuball 01-07-2009, 06:02 PM http://www.answersingenesis.org/creation/v20/i1/appendix.asp
I don't think the function(s) is fully understood...as I stated previously, the problem lies with limited human understanding, not with the Designer
Recent studies also indicate that apparently the appendix is useful in restoring beneficial bacteria after a "flush."
95whitepep 01-07-2009, 10:24 PM LOL at AIB trying to explain the appendix. Wait, was that a Dr. that wrote that article? Wut?
Queen 01-07-2009, 10:56 PM Recent studies also indicate that apparently the appendix is useful in restoring beneficial bacteria after a "flush."
well yes, but for the argument of whether or not it's "vestigial," that doesn't do anything.. "vestigial" is typically labeled based on comparison to the same sort of structure in some other animal that is well-developed and functional in an obvious way. in some herbivores which depend solely on plant matter, the cecum harbors bacteria that can digest cellulose (which mammals can't do), allowing them to get a lot more nutrition out of what they're eating. and in the same way, it's thought to "store" these bacteria in case of emergency. calling our appendix "vestigial" in comparison to that in no way implies that it has absolutely no function, just perhaps that it plays a lesser version of the same role in our own bodies (if you buy this line of reasoning, then yes, our appendices would still harbor bacteria, but we are not herbivores, so we don't need that type of symbiotic bacteria helping our digestion to such an extent)
I'm not trying to jump into this argument; just trying to clarify what exactly "vestigial" implies.. it is based on evolutionary thinking, yes, but it doesn't necessarily mean that any so-called vestigial organ or structure is a useless hunk of meat sitting there
Tofuball 01-08-2009, 07:27 AM * has been informed *
oakback 01-08-2009, 08:18 AM Ok, so we take our "useless" parts, find the analogous part in another animal, and find out what it does in that animal to figure out was it was/should be for? That's neat. Is that the kind of stuff evolutionary biologists research?
DivineRightOfManiacs 01-08-2009, 09:14 AM well yes, but for the argument of whether or not it's "vestigial," that doesn't do anything.. "vestigial" is typically labeled based on comparison to the same sort of structure in some other animal that is well-developed and functional in an obvious way. in some herbivores which depend solely on plant matter, the cecum harbors bacteria that can digest cellulose (which mammals can't do), allowing them to get a lot more nutrition out of what they're eating. and in the same way, it's thought to "store" these bacteria in case of emergency. calling our appendix "vestigial" in comparison to that in no way implies that it has absolutely no function, just perhaps that it plays a lesser version of the same role in our own bodies (if you buy this line of reasoning, then yes, our appendices would still harbor bacteria, but we are not herbivores, so we don't need that type of symbiotic bacteria helping our digestion to such an extent)
I'm not trying to jump into this argument; just trying to clarify what exactly "vestigial" implies.. it is based on evolutionary thinking, yes, but it doesn't necessarily mean that any so-called vestigial organ or structure is a useless hunk of meat sitting thereFinally. A usefull piece of info.
-So does the appendix get used or exercised more in veagans and vegetarians?
Queen 01-08-2009, 08:16 PM Ok, so we take our "useless" parts, find the analogous part in another animal, and find out what it does in that animal to figure out was it was/should be for? That's neat. Is that the kind of stuff evolutionary biologists research?
that is one starting point they use, yes
.
-So does the appendix get used or exercised more in veagans and vegetarians?
good question, but I would guess no.. our digestive systems just aren't built like those of herbivores (and they aren't going to start functioning like an herbivore's just because someone decides not to eat meat), and as far as I know our intestines don't harbor large quantities of cellulose-digesting bacteria. I think if it does function to store bacteria, it stores whatever normal, prominent symbiotic bacteria we have in our guts as humans, so when something odd happens, the bacteria stored it in can repopulate the gut. but, our appendix has a much greater proportion of lymph tissue than the rest of our gut, so if I were to guess about its major function, I'd go w/ yet another lymph organ
czarofzar 01-08-2009, 08:24 PM oh look...queen posted in the religion section
DivineRightOfManiacs 01-08-2009, 08:31 PM Hmmm.
Yer a smart bitch, ain'tcha?
Since nobody's talking about anything else, uhmm, how does it get infected?
And then, is the gall bladder another of the "vestigial" organs? What is bile, and what's it suppossed to be for? (...aside the shit that spews out mark on a daily basis to stink up the Internet)
Queen 01-08-2009, 08:49 PM the appendix is connected to the intestine through a small opening, and it's thought that the opening gets blocked, which leads eventually to inflammation
and the gallbladder isn't vestigial.. it stores bile, and bile serves to digest fats. the liver produces bile which gets stored in the gallbladder. when you eat a high-fat meal, your liver doesn't have to work so hard to produce enough bile to digest it, because it's already stored some in the gallbladder to be released when large quantities of bile are needed. that's why people who've had their gallbladders removed get messed up if they eat fried foods and the like. but gallbladders can be found in other mammals, mainly carnivores whose diets consist of a lot of fat
DivineRightOfManiacs 01-08-2009, 08:55 PM Heh. Mine must be huge.
Are you a med student?
DivineRightOfManiacs 01-08-2009, 08:55 PM lol...dennis has a way with the ladies
Shaddup, Mark. I'm trying to work, here....
czarofzar 01-08-2009, 10:43 PM Queen, I have to stop my bullshit for a short moment because i feel it is important to say, your reasoning is superb. it really shows you have been studying. i am impressed! good job.
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