He lost me when Bush said that he "approved"

Of course Bush is gonna "approve", he's the Republican canidate. What is your issue with Bush?

What is your issue with Bush?

I believe this is the most unintentionally funny statement I've read all night.

We havent had an attack on US soil in seven years so if you dislike him for the war sorry about your luck. I dont think he's been the best President but definately not the worst.

bush failed on most fronts. but ill vote republican. Right now I'm interested to see what obama is up to in Afghanistan/Pakistan.

My issue with bush is I feel like we were being led around blindfolded, wether or not that is the case is unimportant, it is the presidents job to make his nation feel strong whole and united. If he did a good job we wouldnt always be questioning.

I do not like Bush for the following reasons:

1: He has ignored our economic "crisis", especially the oil/gas prices. It's been a rising problem for 2-3+ years, and until a couple of weeks ago, he dodged it.

2: He has yet to recognize the illegal immigration issue, which will be a huge ecomonic strain for years to come.

3: The war in Iraq--No WMD found to date, the sole reason for this war. "MOST" of the Taliban operates in Afghanistan--Afghanistan still isn't in Iraq, and isn't the Iraqi government which was overthrown. Billions of dollars later, thousands of lives later, it's one big clusterfuck mess.

4: Being caught on film flicking people off. He thought the camera was off? I don't care, you're the most powerful man in the world, act like it.

5: He's an idiot, have you ever heard this monkey speak?

How about this for a reason.

http://z.about.com/d/politicalhumor/1/0/y/c/1/obama_borat_parody.jpg

or this

http://www.freakingnews.com/pictures/38000/Obama-Muslim-Flap--38109.jpg

or

http://z.about.com/d/politicalhumor/1/0/j/1/2/obamas_preacher.jpg

If I were to vote... I'd vote for McCain, simply to vote against Obama.

I really do not like McCain but I couldn't imagine ever voting for Obama. I think I'll throw my vote away and not vote for either.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JbsQ7Lv1oe4&feature=related

Obama all the way :D

Don't even get us started on why Obama is a horrible presidential canidate.

*shrugs* Go ahead, if you want. Just saying that I'm putting my chips on him.

After his father's day speech and the fact that he's really one of few candidates that has begun to address the issue of race in this country, I was convinced that he might have what it takes to bring about change.

If he's not, well hell. What's another 4 years of fuckups? We're already running on 8.

I will give a nod to that, YZF. It does bother me that he's just about far left as it gets, but I'm not putting too much weight on it. How many times have presidential campaigns promised to do things in the beginning, only to about face once the reality of the situation comes into play?

I'm sure once he's in office, he'll begin to see the differences between ideal outcomes and actual results.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_broken_election_promises_%28United_States% 29

Well, Unified Healthcare for one. But it looks like you haven't put much thought into this and are voting with your emotions rather than your brain.

Well, Unified Healthcare for one. But it looks like you haven't put much thought into this and are voting with your emotions rather than your brain.

Looks can be deceiving, mate. And if you knew anything about how I work, you'd know I'm about the last person to get swept up in Red and Blue pride.

I have my reasons for putting my bid on Obama, and emotions have little to do with them.

We can discuss this in another thread is you want but I'm done shitting on Dreyko's thread.

*shrugs* Go ahead, if you want. Just saying that I'm putting my chips on him.

After his father's day speech and the fact that he's really one of few candidates that has begun to address the issue of race in this country, I was convinced that he might have what it takes to bring about change.

If he's not, well hell. What's another 4 years of fuckups? We're already running on 8.

In our current state... race isn't an issue.

ill make a judgement in a few days. waiting obama report from mideast

waiting obama report from mideast


What, you haven't heard? They say he's their man. LOL

yeah, lol i can imagine.

http://s.wsj.net/public/resources/images/P1-AM344A_CAMPA_20080723222429.gif

Why can't McCain be the 2000 model more liberal version?

Why can't McCain be the 2000 model more liberal version?


Maybe he figured out thats whats wrong with the country? Too many bleading heart elitist hippies trying to save the world one Communist idea at a time.

1: He has ignored our economic "crisis", especially the oil/gas prices. It's been a rising problem for 2-3+ years, and until a couple of weeks ago, he dodged it.

To an extent I agree with you, but the president doesnt have anything to do with the price of oil or gas. Thats not something to blame him over, plain and simple. And he HAS talked to the countries that produce the oil, you make it sound like he sat back and did absolutely nothing, which is false.

2: He has yet to recognize the illegal immigration issue, which will be a huge ecomonic strain for years to come.

True, but I have yet to see anyone, from any political party, really address this issue, and its been going on for how many decades now?

3: The war in Iraq--No WMD found to date, the sole reason for this war. "MOST" of the Taliban operates in Afghanistan--Afghanistan still isn't in Iraq, and isn't the Iraqi government which was overthrown. Billions of dollars later, thousands of lives later, it's one big clusterfuck mess.

1--it was hardly the sole reason. I would suggest you go back and do a little homework on this one. there were actually five core reasons Bush gave, and he gave them before any action in Iraq took place--lets see if you can get them all.

2--Finding just WMD's was not the goal--Saddam was not only required to turn over all WMDs. He was required to turn over all WMDs, WMD manufacturing equipment and materials, WMD storage equipment and materials, WMD delivery systems and equipment, and all research documentation pertaining to the production and use of WMDs. Are you saying that he did all of these things before the war??? Because he not only didnt do so, but he flat-out refused to cooperate on such a level. Go read the Iraqi Survey Group's reports on this to see the whole picture--they found documentation all the hell over the place, plus they found scores of burned documentation, and even things like bio germ samples at scientist's homes....

3--I would also recommend that you read David Kay's report concerning Iraqis moving an assortment of WMDs and WMD materials to a couple of selected sites in Syria--where no search has ever taken place.

4--then, after all of that, you could also read up on Iraqi General Georges Sada, the Air Vice Marshall under Saddam. This is a man who has been verified to be who he says he is, and has stated countless times that he was personally given the order to have WMD's and WMD materials flown from Iraq to Syria shortly before the war began. Sada also wrote a book, it seems, in which he has detailed no less than 49 flights by cargo aircraft carrying this cargo to hiding places in Syria.

5--after that, you could always, if you still needed more on this, review NIMA's report. This is the US National Imagery and Mapping Agency. In a briefing on 30 October 2003, NIMA Chief James Clapper stated the assessment that, due to the overwhelmingly large amount of Iraqi truck convoys that went to Syria and did not return, that WMDs and related material were in fact sent there.

4: Being caught on film flicking people off. He thought the camera was off? I don't care, you're the most powerful man in the world, act like it.

If the most powerful man can be brought to such a low opinion because he stuck up a middle finger, youre just looking for a reason to complain about him at that point. Thats how I see it. Its a friggin finger, who really cares? Compared to probably every other politician in the world thats nothing....


5: He's an idiot, have you ever heard this monkey speak?

come on, you didnt like "nukular"???

To an extent I agree with you, but the president doesnt have anything to do with the price of oil or gas. Thats not something to blame him over, plain and simple. And he HAS talked to the countries that produce the oil, you make it sound like he sat back and did absolutely nothing, which is false.
Is the president of the united states of america not the most powerful man in the world? We aren't talking about "Everyone else", we're talking about him. He DOES have the power to make a difference, and refused to do so until a few short weeks ago.



True, but I have yet to see anyone, from any political party, really address this issue, and its been going on for how many decades now?
See above--he isn't 1/100 senators, or 1/500 or whatever house reps... he is THE president of the united states, he has more power than any person in the world, he should address it... he IS the leader of the nation.



1--it was hardly the sole reason. I would suggest you go back and do a little homework on this one. there were actually five core reasons Bush gave, and he gave them before any action in Iraq took place--lets see if you can get them all.

2--Finding just WMD's was not the goal--Saddam was not only required to turn over all WMDs. He was required to turn over all WMDs, WMD manufacturing equipment and materials, WMD storage equipment and materials, WMD delivery systems and equipment, and all research documentation pertaining to the production and use of WMDs. Are you saying that he did all of these things before the war??? Because he not only didnt do so, but he flat-out refused to cooperate on such a level. Go read the Iraqi Survey Group's reports on this to see the whole picture--they found documentation all the hell over the place, plus they found scores of burned documentation, and even things like bio germ samples at scientist's homes....

3--I would also recommend that you read David Kay's report concerning Iraqis moving an assortment of WMDs and WMD materials to a couple of selected sites in Syria--where no search has ever taken place.

4--then, after all of that, you could also read up on Iraqi General Georges Sada, the Air Vice Marshall under Saddam. This is a man who has been verified to be who he says he is, and has stated countless times that he was personally given the order to have WMD's and WMD materials flown from Iraq to Syria shortly before the war began. Sada also wrote a book, it seems, in which he has detailed no less than 49 flights by cargo aircraft carrying this cargo to hiding places in Syria.

5--after that, you could always, if you still needed more on this, review NIMA's report. This is the US National Imagery and Mapping Agency. In a briefing on 30 October 2003, NIMA Chief James Clapper stated the assessment that, due to the overwhelmingly large amount of Iraqi truck convoys that went to Syria and did not return, that WMDs and related material were in fact sent there.
I don't really give a fuck, what I heard with my own ears was him saying they had WMDs that they planned to harm the US with... I heard no other reason from him when he got us in this shitfest.



If the most powerful man can be brought to such a low opinion because he stuck up a middle finger, youre just looking for a reason to complain about him at that point. Thats how I see it. Its a friggin finger, who really cares? Compared to probably every other politician in the world thats nothing....
Who really cares? I wouldn't work for someone that I saw flipping people off because I couldn't respect them on a professional level. He is the face of America, and unfortunately represents me. He should know better.

Is the president of the united states of america not the most powerful man in the world? We aren't talking about "Everyone else", we're talking about him. He DOES have the power to make a difference, and refused to do so until a few short weeks ago.

Perhaps this will help you to understand--the price of oil is not set by the government in any way, shape, or form. Thats what capitalism is, son--free enterprise. Its funny how people are always behind capitalism as long as it suits them at that particular moment. The president has no more to do with setting the price of oil than you do, so get a clue. If youre gonna complain about it, then it should be worth learning about first. If it isnt, then dont waste your time and ours by bitching falsely....I think thats fair enough and not too much to ask for.

See above--he isn't 1/100 senators, or 1/500 or whatever house reps... he is THE president of the united states, he has more power than any person in the world, he should address it... he IS the leader of the nation.

He is a figurehead, and thats the fact. He is NOT the "leader of the nation", but he is a PORTION of our leadership. Tell me, since you seem to think youve got this all figured out, what exactly can the president do without all of those reps and senators you mentioned? NOTHING. NO laws passed, NO declaration of war, NOTHING. The president is the head of one branch of the government, and your 7th grade civics class should have taught you this. He is one man, holding a position in a government chock full of checks and balances.....What can he do on his own, seriously? Think about it, even the shit youre complaining about right now in this thread was NOT DONE BY THIS PRESIDENT--it was done by this president AND THE MAJORITY OF CONGRESS, and continues to be done as such!

It isnt my job to educate you, if you care enough to complain then care enough to learn. Its that simple.


I don't really give a fuck, what I heard with my own ears was him saying they had WMDs that they planned to harm the US with... I heard no other reason from him when he got us in this shitfest.

Well, then you and your ears were obviously too busy listening to the opposition's BS partisan politics. For example, for every quote you can show me about how "he said" there were WMD's in Iraq, I can produce three identical quotes from democrats. Bush didnt invent this concept--he was handed the intel from the previous administration--the same administration that was still saying the same things in 2003 that Bush was. How conveniently you forgot--either that or youre just playing the party card now. Either way, to borrow a phrase, "I dont give a fuck".

Oh, and about the "what you heard with your own ears"?? Try listening next time, it does wonders for what you actually end up hearing:

September 12, 2002--Bush's speech to the UN included this statement....

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2002/09/20020912-1.html

The United States helped found the United Nations. We want the United Nations to be effective, and respectful, and successful. We want the resolutions of the world's most important multilateral body to be enforced. And right now those resolutions are being unilaterally subverted by the Iraqi regime. Our partnership of nations can meet the test before us, by making clear what we now expect of the Iraqi regime.

If the Iraqi regime wishes peace, it will immediately and unconditionally forswear, disclose, and remove or destroy all weapons of mass destruction, long-range missiles, and all related material.

If the Iraqi regime wishes peace, it will immediately end all support for terrorism and act to suppress it, as all states are required to do by U.N. Security Council resolutions.

If the Iraqi regime wishes peace, it will cease persecution of its civilian population, including Shi'a, Sunnis, Kurds, Turkomans, and others, again as required by Security Council resolutions.

If the Iraqi regime wishes peace, it will release or account for all Gulf War personnel whose fate is still unknown. It will return the remains of any who are deceased, return stolen property, accept liability for losses resulting from the invasion of Kuwait, and fully cooperate with international efforts to resolve these issues, as required by Security Council resolutions.

If the Iraqi regime wishes peace, it will immediately end all illicit trade outside the oil-for-food program. It will accept U.N. administration of funds from that program, to ensure that the money is used fairly and promptly for the benefit of the Iraqi people.

If all these steps are taken, it will signal a new openness and accountability in Iraq. And it could open the prospect of the United Nations helping to build a government that represents all Iraqis -- a government based on respect for human rights, economic liberty, and internationally supervised elections.

so much for what you and your ears remember, huh chief? Saddam was given five things to do to avoid war, and he didnt do any of them. Oh, and just to make this more interesting, you would be wise to do a little research, you obviously need some--you would learn that the whole idea of regime change in Iraq became official US policy before Bush was even elected....but thats cool, blame Bush--thats what lots of ignorant people do when they dont really know what happened and just wanna complain anyways.


Who really cares? I wouldn't work for someone that I saw flipping people off because I couldn't respect them on a professional level. He is the face of America, and unfortunately represents me. He should know better.

sheesh, get the hell over it already, its a friggin finger....Clinton was much better to work for, I can tell you personally as he was my commander in chief when I served in uniform. Let me tell you, its really fucking awesome to be sent into harm's way time and again by an adulterous, perjuring draft dodger that cannot look past the closest pair of bewbies to save his life....go on, tell me about how professional the face of America needs to be....:bigthumb:

EDIT--I mean this with all sincerity--if you dont give a fuck, then why complain? If the truth is too much to have to deal with, then why bitch about anything? you dont care enough to learn what actually happened, so why waste your time complaining and placing blame as you feel like it? What are you accomplishing, besides spreading more ignorance when there is already an abundance of it in politics today?

http://www.wrapped-in-the-flag.com/images/360_The-Decider2.jpg